195 - The Autogynephilia Controversy with Phil Illy

Stella and Sasha welcome author and podcaster, Phil Illy, to the show for a thought-provoking conversation on sexuality, identity, and self-understanding. They engage with Phil’s concept of auto-heterosexuality, explore his interpretation of "erotic target identity inversion," and examine how these theories relate to broader discussions around sexuality and identity. As the discussion evolves, Stella and Sasha offer their critiques and challenge Phil's framework, pushing for a deeper understanding of these complex concepts. Phil Illy is the author of Autoheterosexual: Attracted to Being the Other Sex , a provocative exploration of sexuality, identity, and gender. In his book, Phil introduces the concept of auto-heterosexuality, describing an attraction to oneself as the opposite sex, and expands upon theories such as "erotic target identity inversion," originally coined by Dr. Ray Blanchard. With a focus on unconventional sexual interests and their psychological underpinnings, Phil's work challenges conventional frameworks and evokes critical examination into the complexities of desire, identity, and human behavior. In addition to his book, Phil is also the host of the Autohetero Files podcast, where he platforms personal stories and discussions that resonate with the ideas and concepts explored in his work. In this episode, listeners can expect to hear a dynamic and often intense conversation, with Stella and Sasha asking difficult questions and exploring the psychological and relational implications of the ideas Phil presents. They dig into both the intellectual and emotional dimensions of the topics at hand. Whether you agree or disagree with the perspectives shared, this episode will leave you with plenty to consider, exploring the deeper questions surrounding identity, desire, and the psychological aspects of sexual behavior. For links and resources relevant to this episode, access the full show notes at Buy Our Book – When Kids Say They’re Trans: A Guide for Thoughtful Parents at Join Our Listener Community to Access Exclusive Content at Support the Show at Join the conversation on YouTube at For more information about Sasha’s & Stella’s parent coaching membership groups, visit: Sasha Ayad: Stella O’Malley: To learn more about our sponsors, visit: Therapy First at Genspect at This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit

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195 - The Autogynephilia Controversy with Phil Illy is an episode from Gender: A Wider Lens Podcast by Sasha Ayad and Stella O'Malley.

This episode is 93:58 long.

This episode was published on Nov 29, 2024.

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