The Trip: 10. Unknown unknowns

During the early weeks of the pandemic, Tim Hayward spent 14 days in a coma. He remembers this time vividly – his days and nights filled with strange, incandescent visions and hallucinations. That experience is something he would never choose to revisit but, around the world, large numbers of people are deliberately seeking out powerfully altered states. In this ten-part series, Tim sets out to better understand a group of substances that induce altered states: psychedelics. There’s been a surge of interest in their therapeutic potential for various mental health conditions - as well as a range of other clinical possibilities. As research around the world ramps up after years of taboo and prohibition he tries to get to grips with - or at least get a clearer sense of - how science, culture, politics and business might all interact in this changing psychedelic landscape, and what it all might mean. He also explores what might be happening in the brain during a trip and whether, by studying psychedelics, we might uncover more about consciousness, imagination and even the mysteries of reality itself. In this final episode, Tim explores how much there is still to understand about the therapeutic possibilities of psychedelics and, furthermore, what other insights research might lead us towards. Will curious minds be given the space to roam free? Contributors: Lucie Berkovitch, psychiatrist and neuroscientist, GHU Paris Psychiatrie et Neurosciences Osiris García Cerqueda, historian and sociologist, Program Coordinator, Indigenous Reciprocity Initiative (IRI) Gül Dölen, neuroscientist, University of California, Berkeley David Luke, psychologist and psychedelic researcher, University of Greenwich Andrew Penn, psychiatric nurse practitioner and psychedelics researcher, University of California San Francisco School of Nursing Peter Sjöstedt-Hughes, philosopher of mind and metaphysics, University of Exeter Presenter: Tim Hayward Series Producer: Richard Ward Executive Producer: Rosamund Jones Editor: Kirsten Lass Written by Tim Hayward and Richard Ward Sound Design and Mixing: Richard Ward Researcher: Grace Revill Production Executive: Lisa Lipman Commissioning Editor: Daniel Clarke A Loftus Media production for BBC Radio 4

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The Trip: 10. Unknown unknowns is an episode from Understand: The Economy by BBC.

This episode is 14:45 long.

This episode was published on Sep 1, 2025.

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