Sebastian Mallaby: The Ghost in the Machine

John welcomes author Sebastian Mallaby to discuss his new bestselling book, “The Infinity Machine: Demis Hassabis, DeepMind, and the Quest for Superintelligence.” Mallaby explains why Hassabis, the leader of Google’s efforts in artificial intelligence, remains an obscure and under-covered figure compared with Sam Altman, Dario Amodei, and Elon Musk, the poster boys of the A.I. revolution; why, despite his relative public obscurity, Hassabis may prove more important in shaping our future than any of them; and whether he is, at bottom, the kind of person we should comfortable entrusting with such power. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: Learn more about your ad choices. Visit

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Sebastian Mallaby: The Ghost in the Machine is an episode from Hell & High Water with John Heilemann by Audacy | Puck.

This episode is 79:48 long.

This episode was published on Apr 20, 2026.

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